The question is: should people post messages of a commercial nature here?
Wiki is kind of like a cocktail party. Advertising on it is kind of like having someone try to sell you life insurance at a party.
On the other hand, isn't it often the case that people find work, perhaps indirectly, after chatting at a cocktail party? --MikeStorey
Certainly. Thus, if you were starting an (or the) ExtremeTeam
, you could ask questions- "How do you find projects?", for example.
If you're interested enough in discussing software development details to be a Wiki participant, then you probably aren't the kind of manager or customer who would like to a hire a Wiki participant.
I don't think advertisements should be posted here. I think that it could get way out of hand since many of us are looking for new work much of the time. But then since most of us are technical non-manager people there are probably better places to advertise anyway. --DonWells
anyway isn't it? plus as AlanFrancis
says further down it won't last that long and every 'advert' posted is subject to unlimited editing by everyone else, not very commercially sound if you ask me. -- SusannahWilliams?
I agree. Please don't. -- MichaelHill
If you did post commercial messages, you could not be assured of their continuing integrity.
People would have the right to add their own opinions to your message.
That may not be what you want.
I'm not so sure. The people here know me. This may mean that many would never retain me on a bet, but some actually might. If I were looking for work, I'd like to be able to post that info here, because it might reach just the folks who could help out. I'd like it to be possible but not get out of control. Some special pages perhaps? Available but not easy, I remain, yours sincerely, RonJeffries
I've hired people with whom I have philosophical disagreements. Heck, it's the same with people I'm already working with, so why should I worry? ;-> What's most important to me is that they have a proven record of accomplishing results. OK, they may not do it my way, but do I really want to hire a bunch of clones? -- JeffGrigg
Well, I did just that, and here's how it worked out. Over the last month I decided it was time to shift my primary consult. No bad blood - I'm still doing part-time stuff for the old place and likely will continue to do that over the next year - but you all know the feeling you get when it's time to go. I hit http://www.monster.com
and a few others ... and I thought, well, why not http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?PeterMerel
? So I did.
Here's my record: I had a dozen interviews over a 4 week period. 1 came from a friend of a friend. 6 came from emailing folk I found via the search engines. 4 came from employers finding me via the search engines. And 1 came out of the blue from an old agency who happened to look me up while I was looking.
In addition to the interviews I got a steady stream of nibbles from people who weren't good fits or who want skills I don't want to use anymore or who want me to work outside San Diego county. Heh. After a month I had three firm offers. I took two of them - one forty hour/week and another 1 afternoon/week to satisfy my YtwokParanoia
about having something to do if the economy tanks next year and takes out my primary.
Not a nibble came from wiki. That's not to say the community here aren't supportive or wouldn't steer work my way if they were in a vindictive mood (:-). It's just that there are much richer veins to mine for jobs. If you want to do XP for someone, my advice is just to tell that to your potential clients up front. Steer them to the online material, or, better, when Kent's book comes out loan them a copy of it. Let them know what you want. In my experience this won't lose you too much work - and what it loses you, you probably wouldn't want anyway.
I guess I should emphasize that this is only my own opinion and if you lose money taking it seriously that's your own silly fault. --PeterMerel
I almost never look at changes to other people's home pages. You'd have to make your XpPositionWanted request more obvious in RecentChanges or I'd never see it. -- JeffGrigg
My own take on this is that when people do their own pages (PeterMerel
for instance) They should be able to say what they like.
But isn't one of the keys to WikiNature that no page is your own, but every page belongs to, may be edited by, any one?
Stopping in the middle of the ExtremeProgrammingRoadmap
to say HELLO ! IM AVAILABLE FOR WORK !
is rude, and isn't likely to last long anyway. If I put that I am available for work doing X, Y or Z on my AlanFrancis
page, people are only going to see it if they go looking...
I don't know if everyone saw this on the other page, you can advertise for work in ExtremeProgramming
. At present it will not help you very much. Not enough people know it exists. But the people who find this forum would now know to look there to find XP people. So I offer it as an alternative to putting "Have gun will travel" messages here. Just drop a message to the webmaster.
I went ahead and created a page for people to advertise http://ExtremeProgramming.org/people.html
I'll certainly take you up on your kind offer, thanks Don. Though my regular dancecard is now fully booked (thanks all) I'd be glad to tell war-stories, lend an ear, or offer a shoulder to cry on for anyone trying to get going with XP around San Diego. --PeterMerel
I think DonWells
was correct in saying that it is wrong to advertise on Wiki. I agree that it is hard to find a project that uses XP, but that advertising here may not bring much benefit anyway! --TomWhite
I knew there was a Wiki page for this: XpPositionWanted. (and XpHelpWanted)
is an example of modest self promotion on wiki. It is linked to the FindPage
. I haven't heard of anyone finding work because of a listing there. -- WardCunningham